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 Message Boards » » what happens when u put r134 in a r12 system? Page [1]  
sharkwing1
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?

6/28/2007 7:31:00 PM

69
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compressor failure due to the inability of the 134 to properly suspend the r-12 oil

6/28/2007 7:35:45 PM

BigBlueRam
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if you retrofit it properly, it'll work fine. some systems take to converting better than others (cooling wise, some never cool as well as they did on r12).

if you're just simply adding r134 into an r12 system, what ^ said will likely happen.

6/28/2007 7:56:29 PM

sharkwing1
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what is involved in the retrofit? im hesitant to put much time in it because its for a jeep that cost less than 500 bucks and it probably has a leak

6/28/2007 7:58:05 PM

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flushing the system, installing a new accumulator/drier, then vacuuming, adding correct oil, and charging



[Edited on June 28, 2007 at 8:10 PM. Reason : oil first, then vacuum, doh]

[Edited on June 28, 2007 at 8:10 PM. Reason : if its a pos, let out the r12, and throw some 134 in there, itll work for a while]

6/28/2007 8:09:33 PM

sharkwing1
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"if its a pos, let out the r12, and throw some 134 in there, itll work for a while" thats the kind of answer I was looking for. thanks

6/28/2007 8:34:54 PM

BigBlueRam
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just get one of those cheap DIY retrofit kits from the parts store. they're like $40-50.

6/28/2007 8:41:45 PM

optmusprimer
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or just put some freeze 12 in there

hell id just put the fuckin 134 in there and let it ride, ive done it a thousand times. on a 500 dollar jeep... fuck it man.

6/28/2007 11:46:30 PM

zxappeal
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Freeze 12 is nothing more than 80% R143a and 20% R142b, and is, in my opinion, worthless.

The 142 is there purely to offer a miscible medium for mineral oil...maybe to somewhat alter the phase-change characteristics of the 134. But it does a less-than-satisfactory job (marginally, if any, better than R134a itself), and you will have similar leak issues with it that most retrofit systems suffer with R134a.

I put it in my '84 Celica GTS...and it cooled rather well for a while...until it began leaking. And then the leak rate grew exponentially until I just gave up; a charge would only hold for two days.

Ivan got to butcher that car shortly thereafter. There is an old Toyota 4-runner somewhere still kicking along with the Celica's engine...fuel injection and all.

A retrofit has to be done properly and with care for everything to work well and be long-lived.


Oh...and R142b is a regulated refrigerant...meaning it has to be handled by a certified technician. Legally, it cannot be sold across the counter to just anybody. Legally, it CANNOT be mixed with any other refrigerant or refrigerant blend, and you should use dedicated charging and recovery equipment with it. And it also requires its own unique retrofit fittings, much like R134a does.

[Edited on June 29, 2007 at 9:34 AM. Reason : more info.]

6/29/2007 9:18:38 AM

Skack
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I wish zxappeal was still doing car work on the side. My bimmer would be the bomb if it had working a/c.

6/29/2007 9:39:33 AM

zxappeal
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I tell you this: there are some things I do like doing...but I believe car work has kind of fallen off of that list. Out of the several AC jobs that I did last year, I think one really turned out well. And oddly enough...it was a retrofit job. I had never had a retrofit that worked so well. In an '89 Celica GT.

I've come to the conclusion that AC work is a crapshoot unless you have a good leak detector and a recovery machine. And I'm not buying any more high-dollar tools...it's not my profession anymore.

6/29/2007 9:49:54 AM

BigBlueRam
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^we finally found tim's leak.... teeny tiny crack in the condensor.
Quote :
"There is an old Toyota 4-runner somewhere still kicking along with the Celica's engine...fuel injection and all."

haha, yep as far as i know that thing is still crusing around durham and getting beat on the trails.

6/29/2007 9:55:26 AM

zxappeal
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Holy shit. So he had to have that replaced...and that isn't cheap.

I feel pretty damn bad about not being available to get to look at his truck. My Raleigh time has been pretty crammed.

6/29/2007 9:57:36 AM

BigBlueRam
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nah, he's changing it out sunday then i'm going to charge it for him. i think he found one at a reasonable price actually.

6/29/2007 10:05:47 AM

zxappeal
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You need a vacuum pump to pull the system down? Manifold? I have both at Frac's house, and you're more than welcome to use both.

When you get ready to charge, put exactly the right amount in as shown on the system label (or you can find it online @ ackits.com)...and figure on only getting between 10 and 11 ounces out of a 12 ounce can. And purge your charging line after every can swap.

6/29/2007 10:13:45 AM

BigBlueRam
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nah, i've got a pump (ancient) and guages. thanks though.

6/29/2007 10:25:51 AM

69
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i usually just suck on it

6/29/2007 10:28:36 AM

ScHpEnXeL
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how bout letting me borrow that pump

6/29/2007 12:22:56 PM

zxappeal
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Only if you use it for its intended function. I don't think you need any 250 dolla penis enlargement devices. At least not using my components!

6/29/2007 1:37:01 PM

BigBlueRam
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^^you're welcome to borrow mine also. you might want to get zx's if you can though, mine is an ancient pos and can be temperamental.

[Edited on June 29, 2007 at 1:39 PM. Reason : .]

6/29/2007 1:39:01 PM

ScHpEnXeL
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hahahha... seriously though, what would a shop charge to vacuum my system and refill it properly? i just put some 134 in there after putting on a new compressor..i couldnt get anywhere near the right amount of freon before the pressure were getting too high and it's really not all that cold so yea, probably would help to have it vacuumed and done right

6/29/2007 1:39:51 PM

Igor
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my a/c compressor just spat out lots a oil and went up in smoke

didnt look too good

6/29/2007 3:37:39 PM

optmusprimer
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http://www.redtek.com

6/29/2007 8:29:11 PM

Seotaji
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Quote :
"what would a shop charge to vacuum my system and refill it properly?"


i'm interested in knowing that too.

[Edited on June 30, 2007 at 1:36 AM. Reason : redtek seems awesome, but does anyone have real experience with it?]

6/30/2007 1:31:16 AM

 Message Boards » The Garage » what happens when u put r134 in a r12 system? Page [1]  
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